Week 2 BlogPoll Ballot
by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 9:00 AM CDT
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Rock M Nation Ballot - Week 2
| Rank | Team | Delta |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Alabama Crimson Tide | -- |
| 2 | Ohio St. Buckeyes | -- |
| 3 | Boise St. Broncos | -- |
| 4 | TCU Horned Frogs |  3 |
| 5 | Texas Longhorns | 1 |
| 6 | Oregon Ducks | 4 |
| 7 | Iowa Hawkeyes | 2 |
| 8 | Wisconsin Badgers | 5 |
| 9 | Michigan Wolverines | -- |
| 10 | Florida Gators |  -5 |
| 11 | Utah Utes | -- |
| 12 | USC Trojans | 7 |
| 13 | Miami Hurricanes | -1 |
| 14 | Florida St. Seminoles | 2 |
| 15 | LSU Tigers | 2 |
| 16 | Georgia Tech Yellow Jackets | -2 |
| 17 | Penn St. Nittany Lions | 1 |
| 18 | Nebraska Cornhuskers | -7 |
| 19 | Stanford Cardinal | 1 |
| 20 | Oklahoma Sooners | -16 |
| 21 | Arkansas Razorbacks | -6 |
| 22 | Notre Dame Fighting Irish | -- |
| 23 | Oklahoma St. Cowboys | -- |
| 24 | Houston Cougars | -- |
| 25 | Virginia Tech Hokies | -17 |
| Dropouts: Oregon St. Beavers, Pittsburgh Panthers, Navy Midshipmen | ||
SB Nation BlogPoll College Football Top 25 Rankings "
Notes:
- Ignore the deltas. This ballot was filled from scratch with zero regard for the Week 1 one ballot. Thus, the "you dropped X team Y spots for beating team Z [score] to [score]???" argument isn't really a factor.
Simple but arbitrary rule: No 0-1 teams inside the top 20. Do I think Oregon St. or UNC end up being Top 20 teams? Perhaps, but I'm not going to rank a winless team inside the Top 20 this week out of principle.Virginia Tech stays on the ballot as credit for opening the season with a Top 10 opponent.- UPDATE: Popular demand calls for Virginia Tech to move up. The amended ballot moves VT to No. 17.
Thoughts? Too down on the Big 12? Do a couple of teams need to go to make room for Georgia, WVU, Auburn, BYU, etc?
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Auburn looked pretty impressive
Still some questions on defense, but Cam Newton is the real deal. I’d toss out Oklahoma State. Beating the tar out Washington State doesn’t prove much. I don’t see that being much different than Mississippi State beating Memphis 49-0 or whatever the final was in that one.
OSU still beat a Pac-10 team worse than Auburn beat a Sun Belt team...
…there’s something to be said for that.
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Please read his post.
Ignore the deltas. This ballot was filled from scratch with zero regard for the Week 1 one ballot. Thus, the “you dropped X team Y spots for beating team Z [score] to [score]???” argument isn’t really a factor.
Annoying You Since 1986
See the first bulletpoint
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And it may have something to do with the fact..
That the defense that is 5x better without Suh in the middle gave up almost 200 yards rushing to a team who has lost 21 games in a row.
Annoying You Since 1986
we'll
say that we lost our starting middle linebacker who makes the defensive calls two days before the game, making him the second starting linebacker to go down with injury.
I notice you didn’t mention that the starting quarterback rushed for 127 yards on only seven carries while scoring three touchdowns……
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by Jon Johnston on Sep 7, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Naturally
Nebraska is supposed to stomp Western Kentucky, it shouldn’t be a surprise if they bring back Richie Incognito to play QB and he has a big day.
On the other hand, even if Martinez is as good/better than advertised, Nebraska still needs the defense to shoulder much of the load. And giving up that many yards on the ground in a blowout to a team that has an amorphous red blob of a mascot is worrisome in that aspect.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
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by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Damn...
…absolutely no love for Virginia Tech.
"Don’t want to spend my night waiting in line unless it’s for more beer."
--EssBee, on LoneStarBall, Jan. 21, 2010
Virginia Tech should be WAY higher
22 spots lower than a team they lost a very tight game to? They were a lot more impressive in Week One than Oklahoma or Florida just to name a couple.
I say you give Boise #1 until someone else plays somebody worthwhile
and get Houston out of sight.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 10:27 AM CDT reply actions
I understand your principle of not putting a winless team in the top 20..
But VT was a bad late hit call or a 3rd down conversion away from beating Boise. With that win they are a top 3-5 team. Not sure I buy them as the 25th best team in the country if Boise is #3.
Annoying You Since 1986
This is college football
There’s a 12 game season with hundreds of close games. Giving credit for almost is a surefire way to be inconsistent when you don’t need to be. I say VT is perfect at 25.
Of course, I’d go straight resume the whole way through, which would leave us with a top 3 of like Boise, TCU, Utah right now. Which is funny in it’s own right.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions
But if your going straight resume...
Then why should Boise get credit for a big win? The team they beat hasn’t won a game yet. How do we know that VT is any good? Or Oregon State? They haven’t done anything yet. For all we know Illinois could be in the rose bowl again this year (can’t say that without laughing but still). At some point you have to use some judgement and eye tests. And anyone who watched that game last night cannot tell me they think there are 24 teams better than VT.
Annoying You Since 1986
Because they beat a power conference team
only a handful of teams did that last week, and VTech is by far the best thought of of the group that includes Oregon State, UConn, Pitt, Illinois, UCLA, etc. If Virginia Tech loses the rest of their games, Boise’s resume won’t look as good and they’ll be dropped accordingly.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions
How do you know that VT is the best of that group?
Based on the results of this season?
Annoying You Since 1986
Based on the information we have
which before the season starts, is just the consensus. You have to use a power ranking at some point when making comparisons, the idea is to minimize it as much as possible.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
In my opinion...
I am more impressed by a team who loses by 3 to the #3 team in the country…than say a team like florida who has less than 30 yards of offense through 3 quarters against Miami of Ohio.
Annoying You Since 1986
The season is too short
and the amount of teams far too great to properly account for all the “nearlys”. Virginia Tech will have it’s chance to play some terrible teams and Florida will have their chance to play top of the line teams. Until then we can only go on what happened, and that’s Florida won the game, and Virginia Tech wasn’t able to.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions
Not to say your wrong..
But that kind of theory with the pollsters is why we have to sit through 90% of big name teams playing cup cakes in the non con.
Annoying You Since 1986
Quite the opposite, actually
In this specific example, Florida is going to get multiple chances at top teams, playing the #1 team and 3 other teams currently ranked. They don’t need a rough non-conference schedule(although they’re playing USF this week and FSU at year-end) because of their conference depth. Virginia Tech gets to play 3 schools that are ranked in the mid-teens currently in the perpetual mess that is the ACC. They need the top end game to make their schedule stack up to the Floridas or even Mizzous of the world.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Ranking a team who plays
A top 5 opponent on a neutral field within 3 points below a team with less than 30 yards of offense 3/4 of the way through the game against a team who has won like 5 games in the past 3 years soley because one lost and the other won is EXACTLTY why nobody schedules tough games. If VT had played Miami Ohio and won, even with their remaining schedule would be a serious national title contender and still in the top 10. Instead, barring a season like 2007, they are done and to some people barely a top 25 team.
Annoying You Since 1986
If I thought VT was the 5th best team, and Boise the 3rd...
Then Boise wins by 3 points, why would that change my opinion. Sounds like the game went EXACTLY as I thought it would. Therefore no reason to move either up or down.
Annoying You Since 1986
No, a resume ranking considers who you play and beat
going by power rankings is how you end up with the same programs staying near the top simply because of their name and inertia. Like I said, if Virginia Tech wins out, they’ll be right where they’re supposed to be.
Rankings are not a prediction, they are a reflection.
"I'm a genius, but I'm a misunderstood genius."
"What's misunderstood about you?"
"Nobody thinks I'm a genius."
by Transmogrified Tiger on Sep 7, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree.
But with a season that is only 12 games…you HAVE to consider margin of victory and how the game played out. The only difference is that I think the rankings are a reflection of how teams have done during the season. You think they are soley a reflection of who a team has beaten.
Annoying You Since 1986
This is the big thing here.
The teams on my ballot have an inertia as close to zero as possible. Things will work out over time. As Virginia Tech wins, they’ll climb to where they need to be.
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess I just differ with a lot of posters in that...
When figuring out which team is better, I don’t feel that any win is better than any loss.
Annoying You Since 1986
I understand the line of thinking.
I guess it’s just so hard to judge “quality losses” with a sample size of only one week.
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions
But thats my point.
Then how to you judge quality wins with a sample size of only one week. It’s like a merry go round, and no one is right and no one is wrong, just different opinions.
Annoying You Since 1986
Bingo.
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions
By that same token
What does Boise State have to do to prove themselves? They beat the ranked teams, they win the bowl games, they move to a better conference to increase their exposure, and yet it never seems to be enough. All of the criticisms are subjective – your schedule is too weak, you couldn’t beat Alabama, you need to recruit better – and yet all they do is keep winning. In my opinion, a win counts for a lot more than a “Yes, but”.
that wasnt a bad call
that was obviously a late hit
the bad call was on the punt return when they thoought he hit him from the side
I disagree.
Although it was a late hit because he stepped out of bounds about 3 yards before he was hit, the player continued to try and run down the sideline as if he was still in bounds. The defensive player cant watch the players feet while he is chasing him to see if he steps out of bounds. What if he gave up thinking he was out of bounds then the guy runs in for a TD.
Annoying You Since 1986
I agree.
The whistle didn’t start to blow until he had already committed to tackling the player too. The guy was definitely out of bounds, but it was still a very iffy late hit.
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that call pissed me off.
as did the non-call on the block in the back on the punt return. as did VT’s game management in the last few minutes on their drive before they gave the ball back to boise state.
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by stlcardinalsfang on Sep 7, 2010 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
The block in the back I didn't think was a bad call.
It looked like it could have been called either way. And if I remember, the officials made the announcement at the beginning of the year that they will call these based on how the player falls. If he falls forward after the hit, they will call it, if they fall sideways they will not. And the player blocked very clearly fell sideways.
Annoying You Since 1986
Hearing everyone loud and clear on VT
Will adjust the ballot once some time opens up this afternoon.
Keep the feedback coming.
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If your going strictly on week 1...
No way florida should even be ranked. 26 yards of total offense going into the 4th qurater against Miami of Ohio? I mean I think they probably are around the 10th best team, but there are 25 teams with more impressive showings than them last week.
Annoying You Since 1986
Who else missed the point?
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
This doesnt apply to the post..But just wanted to say holy shit.
Mizzou’s Phil Pressey had a standing (no step) vertical leap of 37.5". The best leap at the NBA combine this year was 32.0" by Wes Johnson
Uhmmmm…Ya. Discuss.
Annoying You Since 1986
Sorry but Boise and TCU are not the 3rd and 4th best in the country
Boise barely beat V-Tech last night. V-Tech is not exactly the best team in the country. Boise has an extremely easy schedule from here on out and would lose a minimum of 2 to 3 games in the SEC, PAC-10, Big 12 or Big 10.
Sorry but it is the truth. Every week in the big conferences you have to play a quality team, maybe not a top 25 team, but a team with bigger and stronger athletes then anything Boise will see in conference.
Boise being able to get up for one game a year does not make them a national title contender
It's also week one
and this ballot is a fluid situation, as it should be.
Given that Boise State was 2300 miles from home playing a virtual road game against Virginia Tech (neutral site, my foot) and managed to win against an ACC contender, it goes down as one of the best wins of the weekend.
Yes, Boise State doesn’t play in a power conference, but I find it difficult to comprehend the argument that “well, they would lose a minimum of two or three or four games in the [fill in the BCS automatic qualifier conference of choice].”
Really? How do we know that?
How do we know that if they had the access to the recruiting grounds and the geographic location to compete week in and week out that a school of that size and history would be unable to compete.
To make the claim that they couldn’t compete assumes that they would still be in Boise and flying halfway or a third of the way across the country to play ’Bama and Auburn and Florida week in and week out. Or flying into the Big House and Beaver Stadium and The Horseshoe week after week.
And going with the only BCS conference that is geographically near them, I fully believe that right now they could compete in the Pac-10. Would they run roughshod over the league as they’ve done the WAC? Probably not. Could they, today, finish in the top half of the Pac-10? I think they could.
I will accede to this point:
Boise being able to get up for one game a year does not make them a national title contender
but I will only agree because it illustrates the need for a playoff.
And I have a feeling that if Boise State can run the table (which I don’t think they will) and somehow winds up heading to the BCS title game, the rumbling for a playoff will start.
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Yeah, but...
How do we know that if they had the access to the recruiting grounds and the geographic location to compete week in and week out that a school of that size and history would be unable to compete.
That’s not the question. The question isn’t “could they be good if they weren’t Boise”, which your caveat essentially turns it into. The question is "are they the third best team in the country RIGHT NOW? Yeah, change their recruiting ground and put them in Southern California, and they probably could be legitimately great every year – but, then they wouldn’t be Boise State, they’d be USC.
I do agree, however, that we don’t KNOW that they aren’t one of the best 5 teams in the country. We don’t know that they wouldn’t survive an SEC slate this season. Unfortunately, we won’t get any way of figuring that out (until the season ends and Bill can tell us).
But, yes, stuff like that is why we need a playoff.
Considering that quite a bit of their talent
already comes from Southern California, let’s call them the USC of the WAC.
It’s hard to say if they are the third best team right now. It’s hard to say if Alabama is really the best team right now. Or Ohio State. Or Miami (FL).
Quite frankly, there’s no way to determine what the value of a win is in week one until more of the season plays out.
Which is why I think week to week polls are sketchy until the end of September. At best.
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Boise State is Boise State, you can't change that
My point had nothing to do with whether or not, if you move Boise to Texas, FL or Cal would they be really good. They are in Boise and that will never change so why even bring that up
My point is that they are this year not good enough to compete for a national title. Since 2005 they have not had a top 50 recruiting class on Rivals. Say what you want about the rankings, but teams need the top flight athletes and depth to their team to survive a long season in a power conference.
In the SEC, the teams are bigger and faster then the WAC. Players take a much bigger beating week in and week out, so teams have to have depth. Even if players don’t get hurt, players do get tired and more subs are needed. Plus, Boise’s players don’t have to play full games every week because they are going to be favored by at least 25 points in every game.
Boise is going to have one good win on their resume in Dec. and yet people will make the argument that they should play in the National Title game over a team like AL or tOSU because one of those teams will have lost one game in conferences with 3 or 4 top 25 teams, and even the bad teams are going to have almost the same quality of athlete that Boise has.
"My point is that they are this year not good enough to compete for a national title."
Fair enough, but we don’t have the evidence to support that. TCU and Boise have two of the more impressive wins of the weekend, thus they appear where they are. As other contenders come to the forefront and get impressive wins of their own, then it will be time to reassess.
Again we stress how fluid these polls are.
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
It's only been one week and I'm already sick of that argument
Which is why I’m angling for the Boise State-Missouri National Championship Game.
notre freaking dame?!
really?
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by stlcardinalsfang on Sep 7, 2010 11:27 AM CDT reply actions
Why not?
Who among unranked teams looked better?
Honestly, I think Fresno State might have a case. I still think that is a pretty good Cincy team they thumped.
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i don't have a good reason.
but i just hate notre dame and think they’re overrated every year. i also think that this year is no exception.
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by stlcardinalsfang on Sep 7, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I won't be surprised if Notre Dame faces divergent types of bias.
Consistently overrated by the media because of their name, and consistently underrated in the blogosphere for that exact same reason.
Like Bill said, who looked better? Again, THIS IS FLUID. If Michigan curbstomps them, we then reassess for Week 3.
RockMNation.com (@rockmnation on Twitter)
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by RPT on Sep 7, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
fair enough.
though the thought of notre dame being underrated anywhere is sort of mind boggling.
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by stlcardinalsfang on Sep 7, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions
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