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Rock M Roundtable!

1 - As The Beatles and Patrick Dempsey have taught us, money can't buy you love.  But can it buy you a great football program?  Does T. Boone Pickens' wallet give Oklahoma State a chance to become an actual, honest-to-god national power, or are they forever destined to be one step (at least) below OU and Texas?

2 - Coming between Mizzou trips to Lincoln and Austin, the MU-OSU game screams "TRAP GAME!!!"  Will MU stay focused?  Give me a prediction.

3 - Here's OSU's schedule.  Give me a record prediction.

8/30: vs Washington State (in Seattle)
9/6: Houston
9/13: SMS
9/27: Troy
10/4: Texas A&M
10/11: at Missouri
10/18: Baylor
10/25: at Texas
11/1: Iowa State
11/8: at Texas Tech
11/15: at Colorado
11/29: Oklahoma

4 - How many wins does Mike Gundy need to keep his job for 2009?

5 - Ever been to Stillwater?

Doug: 1 - I think the money can help... but having Mike "Screamin'" Gundy at the helm of your football program really doesn't do you any favors.  Just given the reality of the state of Oklahoma, I think OSU will forever play second fiddle to OU, let alone Texas.  This isn't KU versus K-State in football, KSU had a nice, little run, but nothing anywhere near approaching the tradition and power of Oklahoma football versus OSU.

2 - Somone will... oh, you get the idea.  If this were on the road, I would say total trap game, but since it is in Columbia, MU should come away with the victory.

3 - Eh, I think I see 6 losses in that schedule so 6 and 6 it is.

4 - The Shouter needs at least 7, but preferably 7 that come before a bowl game, I think 7 wins including the Fargo Bowl isn't going to cut it.  Pickens couldn't spend his money on a basketball coach, you can be damn sure he wants to spend it on a football coach.

5 - Not as of yet.  Though, I will say, Eskimo Joe's intrigues me.

rptgwb: 1. A program is good facilities and one good recruiting class away from turning things around, taking the next step, etc. You never know who will come up through the recruiting ranks dying to be a part of your program, fall in love with your facilities/town, have family connections, or something along those lines. Half the battle of competing with OU and Texas is money, which OSU and A&M have. The other half is establishing a tradition that can at least compete with OU and Texas. A&M had that at one point, and OSU is still trying to establish that. But you never know what one class or one year can do for a program, especially with those kind of resources.

2. I want to call it a trap game, but I think Mizzou matches up SO perfectly against OSU that I can't imagine a huge scare. Like you noted in BTBS, if you can get OSU out of the game early, they start to panic and fall apart. I like Mizzou to stay focused and put it away pretty early in what could be a shootout if they don't. I like Mizzou, 45-27, after some garbage time points by both schools.

3. 7-5 (3-5 Big 12). I'm not 100 percent sure they win over WSU, but for now I'll give 'em all four non-conference games. I think they beat A&M solely on the purpose that the game is in Stillwater and is Sherman's first conference game. I'll give them their other wins at home vs. Baylor and Iowa State.

4. Judging from everything I've read, I think he needs to put asses in the seats more than he needs to do a whole lot of winning. I think he can have another average year, but as long as he feeds the cash cow by filling up Pickens Stadium, he should be alright. I think five wins is acceptable for him, six to be positively safe.

5. I've driven by the exit for Stillwater while headed southbound for Dallas from Mizzou - does that count? I haven't been out to Stillwater, but it's on the list. I know several people who attend OSU or have attended OSU so I'm considering making the trip in 2009.

The Boy: 1 - My initial thought was that OSU needs that one 'transcendent' type of player or season to break through...a lightning-in-a-bottle type of situation that shows that OSU can be major players.  That would at least bump up the expectations a bit.  The tradition gap between OU and OSU is obviously pretty insurmountable, but if they can continue to establish a presence in OSU and actually make a nice run one of these seasons, then they can at least make it to the Texas Tech level.  Right now they're a step behind, even though they've had good head-to-head success against Tech recently...and if OSU DOES manage to establish themselves at that level...good god, the Big 12 South would then become even more competitive than the SEC East.

2 - If we beat NU, then there will be a decent amount of paranoia (coming from me) about this game.  As I mentioned yesterday, OSU's not good enough to win the South, but they're good enough to jump up and bite any team on the schedule.  They're athletic and streaky.  That  They're mistake-prone, and we've got too much big-play ability on offense.  Mizzou 41, Oklahoma State 21.

3 - I can certainly see a 5-0 start there (of course, I guess I can also see 2-3).  Unfortunately, I can also see a 2-5 finish.  We'll say 7-5.

4 - Initially, I thought Mike Gundy had a lot of rope because he's...well, Mike Gundy.  He is OSU.  However, the unceremonious dumping of Sean Sutton gave me second thoughts.  Granted, the Sutton name has had some of the shine removed recently, and Gundy's still a step higher in the Pantheon than Sean...but I'd say the dude at least needs to make another bowl game this year.  And at any moment, T. Boone could say "I'm sick of this--go buy me a winner."  Especially since they have to raise attendance by about 20K now.

5 - There are obviously more places in Stillwater than Joe's...but Joe's is awesome.  It's just cool to have bars to hit that close to the stadium...and you can't mess with the Joe's brand.  In all, Stillwater's one of my favorite college towns, simply because that's pretty much all it is--a college town.  Good times to be had.

ZouDave: 1 - Nope. This is kinda like baseball in my opinion, where lack of money will almost guarantee lack of success but presence of money is in no way a guarantee of success. OSU will need to combine their money and facilities with proper coaching hires or nothing else will matter. And they're going to have to get a coach on the upswing because the big name coaches that go for high-profile SEC jobs or teams already able to compete for National Titles are going to get money wherever they go. Pickens was not going to be able to lure Bill Self away from kansas, the same will hold true with a Pete Carroll/Urban Meyer.

2 - I don't believe in trap games. You're either going to win or you're not. Mizzou will be extremely focused this year, especially at home. History shows us that Mizzou vs OSU games are decided by a TD or less, as all but one in Big 12 play have gone that way, and three have gone to OT. This game will not be like that. OSU's defense is not up to the challenge, and OSU's offense will lose their running game dimension by the 2nd half because they can't keep up with our passing attack. Missouri 38, OSU 24.

3 - There's a minimum of 5 losses on that schedule. The difference, as with Nebraska, is the Colorado game. I can't wait until Colorado week where I say I see 3 wins, 3 losses and 6 swing games. Anyway, at Colorado will decide if OSU is 6-6 or 7-5.

4 - I agree with Doug. 7 and a bowl game. That should be enough for a team that has to face OU, UT, Tech and Missouri in one season and three of those are on the road. Very few teams in the country would come out better than 1-3 in that section of games so the fact that OSU is going to go 0-4 shouldn't really be held against them.

5 - Unless it's on I-35 in Oklahoma, I haven't been there. I haven't strayed more than an exit ramp away from I-35 in Oklahoma. It's not far from my in-laws' home in Augusta, ks, though so it's entirely possible I make the trip in 2009.

The Beef: I think the money/patience will run out before Okie State gets there. I think you are talking about a need for a sustained…I don’t know…decade before they can get to that level. The stadium is there, now will people come? I believe Okie State average just south of 40K per game last season and now will seat 60K…are there enough Okie State fans to go around? (Much like the argument about how/when/if Mizzou should ever add on to Faurot). So, I think you can improve a football program, but I don’t think the money can take it all the way there when I believe you are going to have to potentially replace a coach after this season.

2 - I don’t see it as too much of a trap game because it will be at home and I kind of enjoy how we have been playing at home of late. I also think the leadership of this team will very much have them looking one game at a time because you can’t win the national championship in October, but you can lose it. And while we will always publically say our goal is the north, then the Big XII, then the national titles, I think that is in the back of head’s and will drive a nice level of focus from the team. As for a prediction, having not yet read anything about Okie State, I will say we win the game 34-17.

3 - Wow…I have them losing the first game, winning the next 3…then losing 2…win, loss, win, and losing out…that would put them at 5-7. aTm could be a swing game, but that would only be 6-6 at best.

4 - More than I just predicted

5 - I have been to Stillwater and have seen us win there….not that I can remember what year that was…2001?

rptgwb: Wasn't 2001 in Stillwater Pinkel's first Big 12 win? Was it the 3OT game?

The Beef: That sounds about right...The Boy's friend literally lived in an apartment complex in the parking lot of the stadium...quick walk...

The Boy: Seriously, that is the most perfect placement EVER for an apartment complex.  Kinda kills the tailgating, really, couldn't park any closer than he lives.

And was either 2OT or 3OT.  It was enjoyable bad football, really.  We saw wins in Stillwater AND Lawrence that year.  And I retired from going to Lawrence directly thereafter.  Never again.  That certainly paid off by my missing the 2003 and 2005 debacles, that's for sure.

ZouDave: May have been a short walk, but nothing you do is quick.

The Boy: Bitter.

ZouDave: just filling in until our resident old man chimes in...

Michael Atchison: Get off my lawn, you lousy kids!

The Beef:

Doug: Way to sum up my life in a single Calvin and Hobbes panel.